'moving to Panama' Panama City

moving to Panama

I am from England and looking at moving back to the Caribbean. I have heard from friends that Panama has very good incentives for those that wish to retire there.

What I would be very interested in, would be to buy a plot of land and build my own home. Can you please let me know the situation for a British person buying land in your country? Also do you have any plots of land that sits back high up that over looks the Caribbean seas?

Any advice would be great. I heard about Alto del Maria, although its not on the Caribbean side it is only an hour away from Panama city so that may be a compromise... What do you think?

Look forward to hearing from you.

Kind regards

Richard Cartier

inse_17@hotmail.com

• you need to now more

I have been on this forum for quite some time. I have written a lot about moving to Panama. My husband and I are building a home in Boquete Panama. If you click on Panama Forum (on the left of this page) then click on Panama Panama City then click on B&B you will see a lot on moving to Panama. I have made reference to several websites you can go to & read and see different things. Please check out Montanas De Caldera in Boquete, that is where we are building our home. If you have particular questions for me - just ask. I check this site every couple of days.

Google: Boquete Panama

Retire to the Country of Panama

Several things should come up for you to look at.

One of things we found in our research is that it is easier to build in a developement and let the developement builder worry about hiring help and meeting deadlines. They also can get all permits needed to complete job. We have heard about some people who have bought a piece of land and hired help to build and in the middle of building the builder wants more money. They even had a contract with the builder.

What we liked about Montanas De Caldera is the Developer has built several retirement communities in Florida and the Caribbean. He and his family is from England and they will be living in the Developement. If you email them, they will send you all kinds of info on the project. Tell Jane that Mike and Darlene from Washington state recommended them. Jane is the Developers daughter and she is very knowledgable. We were amazed at how professional they were. There was not one question they could not answer.

Just list the questions you might have for me and I will answer them one by one.

Hope this helps.

Also, you should live in Panama for at least 6 months to see if you really like it BEFORE investing and making a commitment. Just to be on the safe side.

Just take your time and do everything with care

Its not the duty you need to concern yourself with as they have 10K duty free on container. It's the license issue. I have been told it can take several months if not a year. They move very slowly. So you would have problems with that. You would be better off selling them here and buying a car down there. Remember, US made auto's down there are not easy to get worked on or get parts for. I have been told by the locals that Toyota is a good selling auto down there. We will be moving down there soon. (As soon as our house sells here) Good luck and you can go to just about any Law Firms website down there, and they will address the issue of duty. Google "law firms in the Republic of Panama."

There are a few facts that are not talked about often. Although most Panamanians are nice and polite; there are Panamanians who are not happy with so many xpats moving to their country. You must learn about these things and what areas are comfortable for you before you commit to Panama.

First of all, I'm really sorry about your lost. It must have been a pretty hard time for you and your partner and it seems a terrible thing to go thru. Being in a new country, when everything even the weather is different is a huge impact and I tottaly respect that.

I'm panamanian, I'm married to a british living in England and, quoting his own words "This country is beautiful, but wheter they want to reconize it or not, is not for everybody" and it's true.

Now, as an expat myself, on the hard way I have learned the meaning of the world "adaptation". I came to this country, I came to England, therefore it's my duty to adapt to them, not THEM to ME, or impose what I consider to be right or wrong. Just think about that...

Cheers!

I enjoy the freedom this country has to offer..once offered in my beautiful USA.

Looking for a town that is near but elevated for cooler temperature and hopefully a fewer mosquitos to do my recuperation and physical rehab.

Got any suggestions on that and a security driver, house keeper/cook for the period or should I look at a law firm for the info needed.

I am very sorry to hear about his partner, and I can see how something like that would taint his experiences.

I have been in Panama off and on for about 1 year, and coming here for just over 2, so here is another hopefully no hype perspective.

1. 95% of the population only Speaks Spanish and you Need to Know Spanish.

I would say the percentage of strictly Spanish speakers is less than 95%, but many service people do only speak Spanish. You can get by in your day to day activities without speaking Spanish.

Its a pain, but you can do it. One thing I noticed, is if you attempt to speak Spanish, you get a little more respect and suddenly someone who "Only speaks Spanish" starts talking to you in English.

A good knowlege of Spanish is almost required when things aren't day to day" like your car (or something in your apartment breaks), and accident, etc. It gets very difficult without speaking Spanish.

I say "almost" required because my Spanish is not good, and we have struggled through. I know people who have lived here 5 or 6 years who don't speak any Spanish, but I think that is the wrong approach.

2. Gasoline may be $1.00 cheaper in Miami, I don't know. But it is more expensive in Washington than in Panama. Not a lot, pretty much on par. Much cheaper than Canada.

3. Auto insurance $1300 in Panama, $650 in Miami

Don't know where you got your auto insurance, but ouch. I don't know anyone who spends anywhere near that much. Depending on coverage $200 and up.

4. Purchase Prices of Condos Higher than Miami

Maimi has crashed big time, so this is believable now. I know you could never get a water front condo anywhere on the west coast for $250, 000 though even with the crash. Any major city on the West coast would still be almost double. Like I said, I know Maimi crashed. As a side note, I checked out Ft. Lauderdale, and Panama is still cheaper for an equivelent condo. The gap is less than it used to be though, because the US nosed dived and Panama prices haven't dropped.

5. Getting things Done.

Ok, getting things done is a pain, especially if you don't speak Spanish. But it doesn't take 2 months for a drivers licence and 3 months for a vehicle license. It takes 1 or 2 days max for each depending on how prepared you are, and how early you start in the morning. And in the case of vehicle registration you can hire someone to do it for you.

6. You can't take Taxi's?

Ok, there is a risk. But there is a risk in the US that is just as high. In fact, I have heard of more US and Canada instances of problems in Taxis than in Panama.

You have to be careful for sure, but I have never had a problem and I used to take taxis all the time.

So, I would say risky yes, but a certain death or "Americans don't take taxis" is totally bogus. And "You cannot take public transit" as total garbage. Everyone takes public transit (at least taxis).

7. Groceries more Expensive than Miami.

Have to agree, at least for packaged goods and anything imported. You will definately pay more for your favorite brands of packaged goods. And good beef (which is I admit hard to come by). Produce and local poultry and seafood etc are much less expensive in Panama.

8. Clothing more Expensive in Panama

Hmm depends. Brand name clothing is similar or maybe more expensive in Panama. If you don't care about brand, you can definately get MUCH cheaper clothing here.

9. "Police will Shake You Down ..."

I don't see this. I know I have heard stories about bribes. But this is definately getting better. I have been stopped at several road checks and never had a problem. I got stopped for an infraction and got off with a warning. I had no idea I even broke a law. I did get the feeling he may have been fishing for a bribe, but I can't even say that for sure because my Spanish is bad. Overall, I am no where near as nervous here when I have a police car following me, than I am in the US.

10. Driving Unsafe

Yep, no argument here. They drive like maniacs. If you are a nervous driver to begin with, you do NOT want to drive in Panama city. But I have heard it is much worse in Costa Rica, Milan and other big cities. I can't argue though, it is crazy.

11. Crime / Murder Rate.

First of all, yes there is crime and it is bad. But I do want to put it in perspective. Crime is getting bad everywhere. Home invasions are off the charts in the US and Canada to.

One of our first trips here we heard a shootout in front of our condo. That gave us pause. It was 3 in the morning, and we were getting ready to go to the airport to fly back to the US.

The day we returned to the US though, there was a shoot out at the mall in Seattle, in the middle of the afternoon. So, shoot out in the middle of the night involving a couple of drug dealers or a shootout in the middle of the day in the middle of a mall where there are innocent people around?

Also, yes, the Murder rate is very high. But, a vast majority of those murders are between drug dealers. So the number in my opinion is sku'd. Murders involving foreigners is actually pretty rare (but happens).

Overall, Panama is not without its problems. But, there are problems everywhere. In my opinion, and that of my friends here, the benefit / problem ratio makes Panama a much better choice than the states.

But you have to make your own decision.

I included a link to an article about Casco Viejo that shows how contrasts in perspective can change your views. And why no one should tell you that you will hate (or even love) Panama.

Opening a bank account shouldn't take 3 months either, but the reason it is such a pain, is because of the US's heavy handed rules. Not Panama.

Let me see if I can help. Panama City is very hectic and I do not recommend it to anyone who wants tranquility. Yes most all of the homes in Panama have bars on the windows, except in the newer developments. We just sold our home here in Washington state and are building in Boquete. We have made several trips and fell in love with the Boquete area on our first trip and bought a lot. We will be moving into a development called Montanas de Caldera. (No bars on the windows) Many many years ago, it was not safe to live in a country that supported the drug cartel. Panama with help from the US has done a great job cleaning up the country. I can tell you that I feel safer walking down the streets of Panama City and Boquete than I do in New York City or Chicago or LA. We too have been stopped at check points along the Panamerican Hwy. Never once have we felt we needed to bribe the police. I'm not saying this does not happen, we have just never experienced it.

I have said in this forum many times, "you are a guest in this country, treat them with respect and be kind, don't try and make them see the American way of doing things. Which is often very hurried." When you treat someone with kindness, often you will receive it in return. Like any place in the world you have issues that are hard to deal with, just keep your cool and relax.

The reason we decided on Boquete was they have a huge population of Americans and Canandians and no matter where you go in town, the Pensionado's invite you to sit at their table and chat. We have made some very good friends down there and are very excited about our final move which will be at the end of this year when our home is done.

Go--take the plunge. You will not regret it. This will be a new chapter in our life and we look forward to the challenge. Our kids think we are going through our second childhood. What a great second childhood it will be.

There are things that may drive you crazy. You have 2 choices, you can let them get to you, and you will hate Panama.

Or you can embrase them as different. And you will love it.

One thing I have noticed about the people who HATE Panama, is they tend to exaggerate the bad things. Which makes them pretty unbeleivable. And maybe some people who like Panama Hype the good.

If you are worried, come here and spend a few months. Don't buy, rent. That way you can see for yourself.

Panama City - Big, Exciting, Many Americans and Canadians, Very Hectic, Driving intense.

Pacific Beaches - Much quieter, many Americans and Canadians (boring for some). Getting more ammenitities all the time. New malls, hospitals, ect. Close to Panama City, but not in Panama City. Also includes some higher (cooler areas like El Valle and Altos Del Maria)

Boquette - Tranquil, relaxed, beautiful. A little cooler. Many Expats. Very far from Panama City

Atlantic Beaches (Portobello, Isla Grande) - Beautiful, but very isolated. Very few amenities

Bocos Del Toro - Can't comment. Looks very nice, but limited amenities.

Panama has good and bad thing it all depends on how much are you willing to sacrifice for the good things, comparison with what you dont like in your country

Health care cost is number one here, for most expats, accessible and affordable if compare to USA..

Building a house may be too much trouble if you dont speak the language but is doesn't mean is impossible..if you have the money I suggest to buy something you like and remodel..rather than start from scratch..and rent as long as you can so when you decided you are sure its the best option for you..

You can spend months in Panama and get extension or leave and be back, while you study options and get a feeling..

If you cant live without the main options a city can offer you should stick to panama city , but if you feel comfortable away from the city then chiriqui could be for you,

I am an attorney in Panama if you need further answers and my mom is a realtor, at www.panamagreen.net for rentals and properties in panama and chiriqui.

1- It's highly overrated by most websites mainly coz almost all of them just want to sell you something.

2- Everybody in Panama is a real estate agent, knows one or relates to one for one single reason. Commission!

3- Police does take bribes and they do stop you for a reason or not to do the shaking. However, I usually pay $10 bux and not $80!!!

4- Services are non existent! I even sometimes waited on the owner to finish her personal call and still, didn't ask me for what I wanted!?

5- Panama City is CROWDED, NOISY and POLLUTED!

6- Panama City is way expensive and for no fricken good reason?

7- Weather? What weather? Either rainy or humid!?

8- Mosquitoes galore!

If anybody decides to move to it, he/she should RENT first!

DO NOT, unless you have ton of money and time on hands, try to build anything! They will milk you left and right! Aside from the shabby and untimely work you'd get.

So, to move to Panama you'd have to have a much worse case than it. If yes, move by all means!

Z.

Thank you for sharing your experiences, its important to get a well rounded view. Can I just ask, you say you have been "all over" Panama, could you share some specific opinions on certain areas?

I am aware that Panama is not perfect, not developing (or developed!) country is, but I would like to go there to rent for a while and decide for myself if it is for me. Of all the places you saw there, were there any that were much better than others?

Something must be rotten in Denmark... or maybe it's not Denmark!

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